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Up Topic Open Technical Section / C1 Technical Chat / C'mon questions
- - By timo Date 18-12-2008 18:32
Well, I finally got out into the garage with the c'mon last night.  I have Larry's address, and I am read to send it, right after I get some advise and information from either the group or Jerome, whomever can help.

1. The only vault that I got was "0505 - S -" Idle Regulator.  It occurred twice.  What is that, and should I be looking at replacing something?

2. I went through the tuning menu, and it created another vault, "0121 - S V" Throttle Valve Adaptation, (following programming).  I did not see much information about the tuning menu, and what it truly does.  If the c'mon was mine to keep, I would try out each setting, and see what difference it made, and make my decission, but since I need to get this thing on its way, I would like to know more about the tuning, so I can determine if I want to reset the tuning, or leave it "tuned".  Jerome, what can you tell us about the "tuning" menu, and what each of the functions do?

I think I am just going to reset the tuning, and send it on.  It seemed to work fine as it was.  Looking for some input though.

Thanks for the use of the tool.

Also, one more little bit of input Jerome.  The real time engine monitoring is great, but you need a longer cord.  As it is now, all you can do is leave it hooked up, and leave off the back of the seat.  Even then, reading it would be difficult.  And the RPM readings are difficult to read because it changes so quickly.  Slowing down the read intervals might make that a little easier, or maybe displaying an average reading every second or so.  (I don't really know what would make it easier to read.)  Very cool tool, and I really want to have one now.
Parent - - By jp72 Date 18-12-2008 20:14
Hi Timo,

Thank you for this detailed feedback, I'll keep in mind your advices and suggestion :)

Here are my thoughts regarding the faults that were detected:

1. Idle regulator, this fault occurs 2x since you got the C1 and is not currently pending (in this case you would get "P S -" code). so I believe this is not a big issue. You should remove the regulator, try to clean it, put it back, reset the fault and check if it comes again.

2. The throttle valve's fault came after you tune engine parameters. Basically when you tune throttle valve parameters, I believe that the ECU operate its "servo" to find out the min and max values that can be read on its potentiometer and maybe check also if there are inconsistencies into read values the way round. If I were you I would reset ECU faults (this one is actually stored) and try to re-run throttle valve tuning, if the fault occurs again then you could have an issue with throttle valve block. Just in case you could try to clean the throttle valve internals but I'm not sure how this can be done. Advice from our mechanics gurus is welcome.

So you should try to reset and double check any fault that occurs to make sure it is permanent.

Regarding the other tuning functions they are meant to learn and adapt ECU in reading its sensors values (throttle, lambda and idle). Resetting all tuning parameters allows to reset and trim all three adaptation parameters.

I hope this answer you questions
Parent - - By timo Date 18-12-2008 21:18
Thanks.  I had an issue with my C1 dying at idle a couple of years ago.  I never really figured out what it was, and it went away, (I think it going away had to do mainly with tightening up the battery lead, but I don't know).  One of the guys from South Africa had a very similar issue, and found an o-ring in the fuel injector not seated properly that solved his issue, but I never checked that on mine, since the problem went away.  That issue that I had may have been when that vault was stored.  I have not reset the ECU since I first got it, hoping that some day I would be able to hook it up to a reader, and find out if I had anything stored.  It is good to know that is all that it registered since I got it.  Now I am going to reset everything, and go from there.

And just so I understand the tuning functions.  It is not necessarily changing the way the ECU operates, "performance tuning", but just running the sensors through their range of settings/positions, making sure they are calibrated properly.  Is that right?

One more thing.  I was not sure if the C1 should be running or not while completing the tests, fault readings.  Obviously, it should be running for the Engine Monitor menu, but does it have any effect on the other menus?  I'm guessing if you adjust the throttle valve while it was running, it would make for an interesting show in your garage. :-o  So is it engine monitor menu = engine running, all other menus = engine not running, but power on? or does it matter?

Insert your favorite dumb American Joke here. :-)

Thanks again.
Parent - - By jp72 Date 19-12-2008 06:48
Hi Timo,

C'mon can be used with engine on, except engine tuning that as to be done with engine off, except it would fail. Some functions are not advised while riding has they could affect security like ABS test and fault reading (two German guys are actually using C'mon while riding, they permanently fit it onto the dashboard).

I've done a bunch of tests to insure this would not be an issue, but please dont do this at home :*)
Parent - - By Andrew Date 28-01-2009 10:04
Hi Jerome, Dummie here :-)

Which is the tuning menu? I can see Engine monitor, ECU diagnostic (sub menus Information and Faults), ABS diagnostic (sub menus Information and Faults), Setup. Which is Tuning where the engine has to be off? And does that mean ignition off as well?
Parent - - By jp72 Date 28-01-2009 12:18
Hi Andrew,

The C'mon unit you're using has a former firmware version. You should consider upgrading it to latest.

Regarding engine tuning, it has to be done engine off. The ignition has to be turned on for the C'mon to communication with the ECU

Cheers

Jerome
Parent - - By Andrew Date 28-01-2009 13:47
Thanks Jerome. It may be that it's just the instructions (pdf from Aug 07) which are out of date. I will know once I actually plug the unit into the bike.
Parent - - By jp72 Date 28-01-2009 17:44
Here it is
Parent - - By Andrew Date 28-01-2009 19:32
Thanks Jerome :-)
Parent - - By Andrew Date 01-02-2009 22:26
I tried the C'Mon out today and it seemed to work well. The main discovery was that the 125 bike (which is a pig to cold start) has software version 4000 on it, so I will assume an upgrade to 8000 will help it to start 100% better. Is a BMW dealer the only way to upgrade the software? There was an idle valve fault with an "s" code. I need to sort out a couple of other problems with the 125 first (won't switch off with the key, runs the battery flat and won't move - a few more little challenges :-) ), then get the software upgrade.

The tuning options worked OK on the 200 bike, but wouldn't work on the 125, in fact the only way to move on was to turn the unit off and back on again on the 125. I was probably doing something wrong.
Parent - - By toby_holland Date 02-02-2009 09:21
hello andrew
i had exactly the same problem with all the 'tuning' selections, but got no responses at the time to my query - my software was 7000, so i presume i too need an upgrade, and will watch with interest to see what advice / responses you / we get
good luck
toby
Parent - - By jp72 Date 02-02-2009 18:30
Hi, sorry if I missed that question :(

Andrew, I would suggest you fully charge you battery, switch off headlamp light and try again. Sometime, flat batteries can cause engine tuning to fail.
Parent - - By Andrew Date 02-02-2009 19:33
I've passed it on now so don't worry. The battery was fully charged and the headlight off. Thanks for the support with the instructions etc, it's a clever machine :-)
Parent - - By toby_holland Date 02-02-2009 20:16
........ i did mine with a battery charger connected to the system, in case it wasn't happy with only residual voltages - i even left it a couple of hours in 'tune' mode, but, like andrew, found the only way out was to switch off the ignition, or to switch off the c'mon - having said that, i have noticed that it is running more smoothly now [but slower top speed?!], especially good news in this white stuff [ :-) ] - or is that just me willing it to be better after having c'mon'd it?!
Parent - By jp72 Date 03-02-2009 19:52
I think this is due to you resetting adaptation tuning, that force ECU to relearn all from captors and engine parameters. So I believe the improvment is for real :)
Up Topic Open Technical Section / C1 Technical Chat / C'mon questions

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