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Up Topic Open C1ub Section / Open General Chat / Help Design the next generation C1 scooter!
- - By johnny_Electric Date 18-11-2010 23:53
Hi all, please help me design a concept for the next generation C1!! It is for a university project, and at the end I will make a one-off full- size prototype!! (OMG that's a lot of work :P)
so this is your chance to see all those little thoughts for improvement you may have had be put into practise!

I feel very strongly that the future of 2 wheeled transport is (more or less) C1 shaped, with much more thought given to safety; otherwise 2 wheelers will not survive in an era of anti 2 wheeler legislation.

Please help me design a kick a**e C1 by posting ANY general ownership comments, good or bad, suggestions for improvement, ANYTHING! (the more random the better, really!!)

**Also please say whether a C1 was your first motorcycle/ scooter

H U G E  thanks in advance,  John
Parent - - By bolt-on-billy Date 20-11-2010 09:34
which uni? I hope you are studying plastics as I reckon thats the only way to make it lighter and viable as a lectric vehicle.
Parent - By johnny_Electric Date 20-11-2010 22:33
Weight saving is definately a priority, I need to eek-out every single volt of electricity!
Parent - - By Drynotwet Date 20-11-2010 13:45
C1 not my first bike. Same for say 90% of owners

I see the new elec c1 doesn't have the same level of weather protection. That ISA mistake on Ssuch a bike in the UK given that the extra weight of non structural weatherproof material is minimal.

Charging system should be 240v, so existing network of petrol stations need minimal additional equipment to provide an
Emergency 1 hour charge to get you going if you run out of juice in your travels
Parent - By bolt-on-billy Date 20-11-2010 18:27
with an emergency slot for AA batteries :-)

if you were really clever then you should in theory be able to coat panels with flexible solar cells.

daft as it sounds old sir clive had the right idea with a trike you could pedal when it went flat, if we ever work out a way to tap into the human body there's a house worth of electricity in there
Parent - - By johnny_Electric Date 20-11-2010 22:52
Thats interesting, because I've read that BMW tried to appeal to car drivers/ people who had previously never ridden with the C1, which is what I'm gonna try and do again with my next gen concept, hopefully I'll be more successful :-)
Parent - - By jrw Date 21-11-2010 09:57
Yes - major marketing mistake by BMW. The car dealers sold the C1 but could not service them so the bike dealers had to service the C1 but were not allowed to sell them. As a BMW bike dealer they were obliged to do warranty work for free and they got very pissed-off. Additionally the car salesmen got little commission from selling a C1 compared with a car so the salesmen were not enthusiastic and on the whole talked the C1 down. BMW managed to upset just about everyone in the trade in the UK which was a remarkable achievement.
Parent - - By bolt-on-billy Date 21-11-2010 13:54
I wonder if its feasable to use an airbag protection system to cocoon the rider?
Parent - - By johnny_Electric Date 21-11-2010 23:36
Yes I am definately looking into having a tank mounted airbag, 
Parent - By superted Date 22-11-2010 09:49
Tank?
Parent - By bolt-on-billy Date 23-11-2010 13:38
hmmm again which uni  we can probably find someone near to you so you can gets some hands on.
Parent - - By Leec1 Date 22-11-2010 12:00
It was my first bike @ age 30 never had bikes before.  I think this concept has a lot to learn from:-

http://www.gizmag.com/peugeot-hymotion3-three-wheel-concept/10195/

This is the way to go next in my view with i) seatbeats ii) safety frame iii) Top/back box nice and big like the current C1 iv) a proper stand (bolt on could design a proper one for them!) v) 2 engine offerings 125 & 400/500 engine for learners/experienced riders vi) Find a way to avoid having to wear a helmet i.e. width of wheels, call it a trike I dont really care but find a way

That would have my real attention and searching for the cheque book
Parent - By dobedobedo Date 23-11-2010 21:17
I agree, the perfect bike - just keep it narrow enough to get through city traffic.  The trouble with bikes today is they are getting paunchy rather than punchy.
Parent - - By C1ive Date 22-11-2010 15:00
If you could mate the bottom half of a Gilera Fuoco (or hybrid Piaggio MP3) with the top half of a C1 you would be well on the way to building a winner IMHO.

If you want to stick with 2 wheels, on my wish list would be a larger C1 engine, larger wheels with stronger front wheel bearings, seating and seat belts for 2, powerful twin front lights and high level indicators and brake light to the rear, a proper front mudguard, a sound system with Hein Gericke speakers, hagon rear shocks and a highly secure back box.

The C1 was my first scooter. Having already been hit by two cars in the rear, I don't intend to ride anything else without a crash cage and seat belts, so another bike with these features would be very welcome! Good luck with your project.

Parent - - By bolt-on-billy Date 22-11-2010 17:50
problem with the piaggio three wheelers is they are terribly unstable and fall over too easy if you forget to lock them off and stick your feet down, the extra weight up top would meat it would slide too easy I reckon, unless you spread the front wheels a couple of feet apart
Parent - - By Drynotwet Date 23-11-2010 00:35
Any moderators want to approve those posts?
Parent - - By jrw Date 23-11-2010 09:38
Approve in what way?   or why?
Parent - - By Drynotwet Date 23-11-2010 12:26
There are unapproved messages in his thread, which means they are hidden. I believe they woulde be from anew member.
Parent - - By jrw Date 23-11-2010 13:21
Thanks for remarking on this - as both Superted and I could see the messages it had not occurred to me - in fact I did not even know about this facility. :-)
Parent - - By superted Date 23-11-2010 13:37
Well I did wonder what you were on about  :-)
Parent - By Clunkfish Date 23-11-2010 13:50

>Well I did wonder what you were on about  :-)


Me too, but have now joined the poster in question into the "Trusted Member" group so that their posts will no longer need approval. (This group was set up when we were having a lot of problems with spambots.) Thanks for flagging it up :-)
Parent - - By aware Date 23-11-2010 22:24
Definitely a two-seater.
Parent - By Mad_Accountant Date 24-11-2010 21:02
Over the 10 years I have owned C1s the stands have been generally reliable. I'm sure the b-o-b mod is a good'un but I haven't needed it.

Similarly the only problems I have had with the front wheel bearings was when I was sold a pup (not only were the bearings shot but they had taken the front wheel with them) :-(

I think C1 as it stands is a great tool, sure some hyraulic valves would have been nice but valve checks at my BMW dealer have not been a huge issue.

I don't feel there is any chance of a 2 seater C1 - the bike would end up too long and not fit into bike bays. Keeping two belted riders physically separated within the size contraints presented is a tall (long) order.

As I have said many times before C1 is at it's best as it is, if they relaunched the model I would buy new tomorrow and yes it would be a 125 :-)

Once you start asking for extra performance with seating for two + luggage you may as well go to a bigger bike - the R1200Rt, the R1200GS (+Adventure), not to mention the Japanese imposters :-) have to be the next step but if you wish to stay with scooters let's all hope the Concept-C is all we wish for.
Parent - - By Andrew Date 25-11-2010 14:33
I'm one of the apparently rare people who came to motorcycling only because a safe motorbike became available in the form of a C1. I was one of the first to own one in the UK in 1999 and have had one ever since. For me BMW were spot on with their target market i.e. car drivers who used to sit in commuter jams every day thinking "if only those bikes filtering through the traffic could be made safer..." And then bingo BMW launched what I wanted and I couldn't wait to pay them top undiscounted price as soon as they reached the Manchester BMW bike showroom (not sold by car dealers round here).

Personally I don't care about weather protection, a decent waterproof suit and helmet can do that, all I wanted was something to let me filter through the jams with a good degree of safety. In 11 years I've only broken one weak link, and that's because the salesman gave me good instruction before I rode it away for the first time. Yes front wheel bearings are a pain, so are valve shims. I've never yet found anybody wanting to be seen riding on the back of my C1 so a single seat is just fine! Performance for commuting is fine, but a bit more grunt and high speed cruising ability would be nice. I think the biggest drawback to sales has been the wierd appearance of the C1, it needs a better looking design, but I've no idea how that could be achieved. But that's subjective and I am still surprised and slightly suspicious when someone says it looks cool.
Parent - - By dobedobedo Date 25-11-2010 23:17
Well put - same for me.  I would never have gone back to two wheels if the C1 hadn't been available.  Though today one passed me with a wind kit and I did get a pang of envy...
Parent - - By toby_holland Date 26-11-2010 06:33
'passed' you going the OTHER way, hopefully!! or does your milkfloat need a recharge ?!
the safety aspect IS vital, i often use mine in preference to my GSX1400, and particularly when jambusting with the tintop brigade.
roll on the next one [fuel cell maybe?!]
Parent - - By chairman21 Date 29-11-2010 18:24
I've been lusting after the MP3 with a full body enclosure. I would gladly pay a lot of money for this kind of bike. The design can best be seen here on a two-wheel bike http://www.bikeweb.com/node/280 in colour and a black and white MP3 version here: http://www.bikeweb.com/node/1162

I'd bloody kill for one of those. Don't care about weight/noise/etc. as long as it keeps me warm running around city centres and can cruise at 70mph. I'm convinced the future will be like that. Essentially cheap three wheeled cars for the masses (with seatbelts and roll cage as standard), or two-wheel versions only popular with motorcyclists.

Had many bikes before my C1s.

Alexis
Parent - - By johnny_Electric Date 06-12-2010 16:02
Some of those concepts are really interesting, cheers for sharing! Particularly the monotracer, its good to hear you like the idea of enclosed motorcycling, and very interesting that you had many bikes before C1's, I think that seems to be the general trend... even though BMW was trying to attract car drivers,
Parent - - By chairman21 Date 06-12-2010 20:59
Hi Johnny,

I'm tempted to say 'how much money do you need to build the orange MP3 above...' but can't put my money where my mouth is. I'm convinced it takes some sort of Apple-like company to come up with the all-enclosed motorcycle/scooter, that catches the public's imagination and starts a revolution. No 'iPod' jokes please!

Out of curiosity, how much would it cost to build a simple (no fancy interior or custom designed dashboard) 'pod' to enclose an MP3?

Alexis
Parent - By Mad_Accountant Date 13-12-2010 07:52
I think Concept-C will be with us in 2012

I am 100% certain that I will be buying one on the first day it is available :-) but I seriously hope they dump the rear view cameras!
Parent - By dobedobedo Date 13-12-2010 20:27
What's the point of it?  Oh no, it's round - there isn't one...
Parent - - By elmstones Date 20-12-2010 18:15
I want one of those sit inside the wheel types vehicles as seen on star wars (one of the newer pre-quel films)
Parent - - By elmstones Date 20-12-2010 18:21
closest picture I could find :-)
Parent - - By elmstones Date 23-12-2010 23:22
I like the single wheel thing you sit inside you get that C1 feeling
Parent - - By chairman21 Date 12-01-2011 17:25
This is what we really need, forget the ground-based concept. Have wings/will fly.
http://indonesia-hits.com/2010/06/06/roadable-aircraft-worlds-first-commercial-flying-car-a-reality/
Parent - - By chairman21 Date 27-01-2011 17:59 Edited 27-01-2011 18:03
And now this stunning design:
"The NEOS also boasts of a modular sidecar that can be detached when not required by the rider. The sidecar can be used to carry things and store items."
http://walyou.com/neos-motorcycle/

The other two images are from http://walyou.com/cool-electric-scooter-designs/
"The Cargo Electric Scooter made me think of a greener place when delivering packages. Instead of large DHL or UPS trucks being stuck in traffic, causing a lot of smog, and taking time to get to your home, these scooters could be a nice new way. For medium sized packages, letters, and shipments, the Cargo Electric Scooter could make its way on the streets a lot easier and put a smile on the delivery man’s face."

And the one we all really want:
http://walyou.com/flying-jet-scooter/
Parent - - By jrw Date 28-01-2011 09:03
The Neos sidecar looks dodgy - not much leverage to stop the combo tipping over especially when empty.
Parent - - By chairman21 Date 29-01-2011 21:58
When the side car is empty, the wheels go back to a symmetrical position; otherwise it would be unbalanced.

Not sure what the point is in the bmg turning from a classic chassis bicycle configuration to a monocycle. What's the advantage of balancing on 'one' wheel?
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Up Topic Open C1ub Section / Open General Chat / Help Design the next generation C1 scooter!

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